Army Ranger Snow Training?

Every once in a while I run into U.S. Army types doing what appears to be training at Crystal Mountain Resort. They seem to have old style skis with cable bindings. Does anyone know what they are doing and why they are using what looks like old gear?<br><br>I am not sure, but they may have been in non-ski boots. I am wondering if the Army should be looking at modern alpine touring gear?<br><br>Has anyone seen Army in the back country?<br><br>

At Kirkwood in California I'd see Marines ski training quite frequently. They were from the US Marines Mountain Warfare Training Center at Sonora Pass in the Central Sierra. By coincidence I ended up riding chairlifts with several of them several times. They were very friendly and always seemed to be having a good time.  Though I never did, if you frequented Sonora Pass it was not unheard of to see them in the backcountry. At one point I was actually told the exact gear they were on though I forget the specifics other then it was some form of Karhu skis made with white topsheats, cable bindings and leather boots (though some of the instructors had light plastics). <br><br>I'd agree that our military should have better ski equipment. Given that Bush II has a 2nd term, that I am of drafting age and the possibility of a an Iran invasion (there's skiing there!), I propose all military personal and those registered with the selective service be immediately issued Atomic REXs, Dynafit Comforts and MegaRides. Oh and a personal howitzer for avy control too! <br><br><br>There was a really, really good article about the USMC Mountain Warfare Training Center in Outside several years ago by Mark Jenkins. You can read it here (it's worth the read):<br>outside.away.com/outside/news/200202/200202marines_1.adp

An exerpt:
"On day four, maneuvers are supposed to begin at one in the morning and include ice climbing, but there have been several "environmental casualties" among the novice instructors. One marine got his hands severely frostbitten and may lose several fingers; one scalded his hand while boiling snow water; one went down with vomiting and dehydration. And another was struck in the eye by an M-16 shell casing and burned his cornea during a midnight live-fire ambush"

Sounds almost like a TAY trip eh?  ;)

And a photo from that article:
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Great reply, Jeff.<br>Good info.

Right, Gaper... the gear you describe sounds just like what the Army guys are using. <br><br>After my original post, it occured to me that perhaps:<br> - They want to operate with their regular combat boots.<br> - They need to be able to interchange skis between team members. Generally, ski gear is fitted to the skier.<br><br>However, it seems to me that at least they could go to plastic mountaineering boots. And, why not use powder skis?<br><br>I once saw a video of the Marine snow training... pretty tough. They had to jump into a lake through ice and then get themselve out. In the Navy, I got to jump into a nice warm swimming pool and swim through barrels on the bottom of the pool with a rifle. You just never know where those commies would be hiding!<br><br>So how many of you would be willing to go through that Marine snow training? I think some of you guys could put up a good show.

I just read that great article on the Marines... they did mention something about the gear:<br><br>...The gear, too, is first-rate: Capilene long underwear, Polartec fleece, Gore-Tex jackets and bivy sacks, Alico three-pin boots, The North Face tents, MSR WhisperLite stoves.<br><br>These guys are at a higher level of training.<br>

Is there any AT gear that isn't from overseas? Lowest bidder, and all that.

I've run into military training groups on those white skis a couple of times, including coming down after a week in the Eldorado area. I've also seen them training in alpine climbing up on Baker. One of their instructors once told me they were strong, tough, and good at following orders without question...but their technical skills were more or less in line with other beginners.

I have seen them from time to time either at Crystal Mtn., at the Huckleberry creek snopark, or at Camp Sheppard where they stay during the winter.  They used to have a camp at Huckleberry creek. <br><br>They ones I saw used cable bindings with leather boots.  I haven't noticed what brand.  Several times I have talked with them .  I rode the chair at Crystal last year a couple of times with a group of them.  They are always friendly and seem to be having a good time.  I would too if somebody paid me to play in the snow.

I think I remember seeing soldiers at Crystal Mountain on pretty decent gear. I remember them using plastic mountaineering boots and Silvretta bindings. This was a few years ago and my memory may be faulty. These guys were riding the lifts. Maybe there are different units who train up there using different gear.<br><br>I believe Paul Ramer used to sell bindings to the military, but I can't recall ever seeing any soldiers using them.