GPS Expertise Requested

Are there any GPS experts in the group? Any advice for a guy begining a search?<br><br>My only parameter at this point is that I'd like to spend under $200. It would be used for 1-2 day ski tours.<br><br>Or does anyone feel that GPS is just another unnecessary gadget?

A GPS is a handy gadget -- but no substitute for map and compass skills and route marking using wands / tape. <br><br>They are definitely convient for navagting above timberline in the fog -- it's nice to have a waypoint marked for Panarama Point when you're enveloped in fog on the Muir snowfield. <br><br>Using them to navagate through the forest is kess reliable -- heavy forest and an enclosing valley often results in widely varying position reports.<br><br>I currently use a Garmin Geko 201 -- nice light and compact unit -- connects to Maptech terrain navigator software so I can download routes (and upload waypoints / tracks from the field) Battery life is around 10 hours on a pair of AAA's -- always bring plenty of extra batteries.<br><br>I purchased this unit from GPSDiscount.com for only $115.

I bet there's lots of GPS nerds in this group . <br><br>I'd strongly recommend that whatever you get can take topographic maps.  I have the Garmin eTrex Legend which is exactly $200 at REI right now. The Legend accepts maps from Garmin's proprietary software, MapSource. It has 8MB of memory for maps, waypoints and tracks. Even having multiple maps in the system I've not managed to utilize all its memory. The unit is easy to use, small, durable and connects to your PC via Garmin's software or National Geographic (though you can't upload the maps from the NG software).<br><br>For my purposes I feel the Legend is the best GPS Receiver for me in the current market. However, there are numerous gripes I have with current GPS Receivers.<br><br>Here's my biggest gripes:<br>- Battery life is pathetic. I like to leave my GPS on whenever I'm moving so I can make pretty maps when I get home. However the batteries only last about a day. The Vista (the next model up from the Legend which has a built-in compass and barometer) even has worse battery life.<br><br>- Memory is proprietary. I want a GPS that uses standard-based portable memory, like Compact Flash. Magellans have upgradeable memory however it's proprietary.<br><br>- Accept higher resolution topos and establish a GPS topo map standard. Right now GPSes can only take 1:100,000 scale topos, which while better then no GPS map (yes I realize you'll always have a paper map, it's not the same though) leaves details to be desired. I'd like a GPS that can take 1:24 maps and work with any GPS software (ie, an industry standard needs to be established for maps; right now Magellan's and Garmin's software are both proprietary).<br><br>- Faster map scrolling. I want a GPS that can instantaneously scroll maps.<br><br>- A USB or Bluetooth interface. I understand some of the newer GPSes have the USB interface (eTrex not being amont those). I'm unaware of any GPS that uses the wireless Bluetooth interface. <br><br><br>Edited a zillion times to fix typos<br>

OK, well, I'm trying the Cobra GPS 100 now and not happy with it at all.<br><br>I was swayed to pick it up due to its $99 price tag, and because it has an altimeter and compass.<br><br>This unit will be returned. I've been experimenting with it for three days and find it unintelligable. The only thing that is user friendly is the altimeter, although it is spotty. I found that "backtracking" is flipped 180 degrees. So to back track you forward track... Seems like something out of Willy Wonka.<br><br>Anyway, great marketing on this one; feature richness at a sub-$100 price. Unfortunately, the marketing seems to be the only good thing about the Cobra 100.<br><br>I'm going to try the Garmin Legend.

My advice is:<br><br>You don't need a GPS with fancy mapping or topo capabilities.  You should know the area, or have a topo printout with you anyway.  Any GPS will let you create waypoints by entering coordinates before you go on a trip.  So you go on www.topozone.com, explore the area where you will be traveling, and pick a few spots on the map that you want to use as reference points in your GPS.  Then program those coordinates into the GPS, and you will be able to use the GPS to find them.

I use the eTrex (basic kind, $110).  It has long battery life (important when you take into account the diminished power of batteries in the cold), provides very accurate and precise altitudes with 5+ sattelite signals, and does everything that the more pricey models do, except that it has basically no mapping capabilities.  It has a little "map" display but it is a joke.  But that's not a problem, because you shouldn't be using your GPS as a map anyway.  I just program a few critical points into the GPS, and the GPS will tell you the direction and distance to any of those points.<br><br>If you get an eTrex, you can interface it with your computer using free software (www.lexicon.net/firstwaypoint/gps/links.htm) and you can even save $30 by making your own interface cable.  I recommend GPS Trackmaker.

A couple more thoughts-

Never rely on GPS for navigation if you will be in the woods.  GPS signals do not penetrate tree cover.

Don't forget to mark the location of your car before you head out.

. You know I'm just a old codger who like's a map and compass but I do have a GPS that I like and is helpful. All the above is true you can run the full tech dealllHey Ron where are you? But I would never depend on the damn things......(a long story...)  <br><br>  However a sweet setup I think is a Gps such as a garmin 12 as I own that cables into your PC and Topo map program  fun and easy to playwith you down and up load tracks , way points and its all fairly straight forward. The benefit is you are using your topo map in hand and  turn on the GPS to confirm where you know you already are. Just a another tool in the pocket<br><br>Cordially<br>cw

Here I am, Charles.<br>Lots of good advice here.<br>Guess I could be considered a "geezer gear geek" but hey, not as geeky as Jeffey! Jeeze, that guy really knows a lot about gps technology.<br>I'm on my 3rd gps unit, an eTrex Summit, which I've had since the model first came out (5 years?).<br>Like the others recommend, I always carry a map and compass and know how to use them. I may also use the gps more than most other users I know. I use the gps extensively in conjunction with the Topo! computer mapping software. I leave the gps on during tours so that I can bring it back home and upload the track into the Topo! software and study the track on the computer map. I find it fascinating to review the trip that way and it helps me become more familiar with an area quicker. When planning a trip to a new destination I set up waypoints and route for the trip and print out a new Topo! map showing that new route.<br>Of course, as mentioned, the gps's usefulness in times of low visibility are invaluable and could mean the difference between and unplanned bivy and a "business as usual" tour. I believe another reason to leave the unit on during regular tours and refer to it often, is so one can gain intimate confidence in it's use and trust in the information it provides. In times of high stress and low visibility it is extremely easy to distrust the information on the machine, not unlike the way a VFR pilot distrusts instrument info when inadvertently placed in whiteout conditions.<br>Which brings us to the subject of batteries...<br>I've found that the eTrex series works better when the battery voltage is higher (as evidenced by the quality of the track after a trip, which seems to be affected by the # of sattlelites the unit stays locked on to). Battery voltage drops off as the battery loses charge. Different types of batteries lose voltage at a different rate in relation to their total battery life. The eTrex uses two AA batteries whiich in the case of most throw aways, come out of the package at 1.5 volts. Most AA rechargables are only 1.2 volts fully charged. So they don't seem to last long in the unit before it starts losing sattelites (maybe a half a day?). Alkaline batteries are 1.5 volts fully charged so they work pretty good for a while. But in as much as their voltage drops gradually, they are usually done for in the eTrex type units after about a day, even though they might have plenty of juice left to run some other type of device (including a GPS 12, which doesn't seem to care what voltage it is getting).<br>AA lithiums (roughly twice the cost of Alkalines) maintain their voltage at 1.5 volts until almost dead, plus they store more energy, so they last a long time. I usually get 3 or 4 trips out of a set. So they work better and last at least 2 ore 3 times longer. The also weigh about half that of the alkalines, so you really get a better bang for your buck. The best place I've found to buy them is at Walgreens or Office Depot, about $2.25 each, in quantities of 8.<br>One last item related to battery life in the eTrex unit:<br>On the units with the built in electronic mag compass (Summit and Vista?), you can set up the unit so that the compass is on or off. With the compass on, obviously, it uses the most juice. With the compass off the only direction information you get is the gps track across the ground; the unit just assumes your heading is the same as the sensed track. There is also the ability in the setup software of the unit for the direction info to switch to compass below a selected speed. I have mine set up for that speed to 1 mph so that the compass is always off when I am moving, but comes on when I stop.

 I leave the gps on during tours so that I can bring it back home and upload the track into the Topo! software and study the track on the computer map.  I find it fascinating to review the trip that way and it helps me become more familiar with an area quicker.<br>

<br><br>I also greatly enjoy reviewing my maps in Topo!/National Geographic upon trip return. I find that it has improved my topo reading skills. <br><br><br>

<br>AA lithiums (roughly twice the cost of Alkalines) maintain their voltage at 1.5 volts until almost dead, plus they store more energy, so they last a long time.  I usually get 3 or 4 trips out of a set. So they work better and last at least 2 ore 3 times longer. <br>

<br><br>Good idea, I'll have to try it. Since the lithium's battery life drops so abruptly do you ever find it difficult to detect when they're about to die?<br><br>Ron, since you leave your GPS on all the time, where do you store it? I was concerned that putting my GPS in my pack would adversely impact it's reception so I always store it in a pouch on one of my shoulder straps. It makes me look ultra geeky as I have a camera in a pouch on the opposite shoulder strap and sometimes even a pulse oximeter on my sternum strap.<br><br>Gaper Jeffey

<br>Since the lithium's battery life drops so abruptly do you ever find it difficult to detect when they're about to die?<br>Gaper Jeffey

It can sneak up on you... but if you're looking at the battery charge icon, say at least hourly, you'll pick up on it.<br><br>

<br>Ron, since you leave your GPS on all the time, where do you store it? I was concerned that putting my GPS in my pack would adversely impact it's reception so I always store it in a pouch on one of my shoulder straps. It makes me look ultra geeky as I have a camera in a pouch on the opposite shoulder strap and sometimes even a pulse oximeter on my sternum strap.<br>Gaper Jeffey

I think you're right; I think carrying it in your pack will affect the reception. I'm of a similar geekiness, 'cept I don't have the oximeter. Where do ya get 'em <br>

All this talk of GPS inspired me to take it to the Mt. Baker Ski Area (gasp(?)) today. I just held it out from my body in one hand to map out a run and see how fast it would clock me (it was 3:15, I was bored, and all of the lift-accessed powder was tracked out). I had considered snowshoeing to Artist Point and beyond but the avy forecast (and my inexperience) disagreed.<br><br>Does anyone here own, or have experience constructing, a splitboard? I have the perfect old board and a desire to find out what all of this 'skinning' is about.

Run with it man.break trail in 2 feet of fresh with nothing on your back laying down a highway skin track and you'll never go back.Be carefull though it's like crack once you try it your hooked .it's all you can think about next thing you know your skipping sleep to go play.

Stefan: your the master of no sleep tours!  Back to gps: I use a Magellen sporttrak pro. From the reviews I read before puchase it seemed to have the best ability to maintain a track in the forest. It hasn't disapointed. here is a sample track on Topo! near Alpental. The unit is bigger than the Garmins, but that helps with the geeky look . Ron's battery advice is very good, go with lithium. <br><br> http://images.snapfish.com/339344%3A%3B23232%7Ffp46%3Dot%3E2329%3D%3B33%3D3%3A9%3DXROQDF%3E23234764%3B6647ot1lsi