White River Rd to Campground

I just checked the road conditions for MRNP.


White River Rd to Campground
Scheduled opening May 19.


Anybody have any idea how likely this opening will be?
-Gus

This is a full week earlier than "usual". And its a decent snow year. So something does not quite compute. However I am very hopeful they do open; seems like summerland or the usual interglacier could be really good with potentially partially skiable conditions up to glacier basin. I wonder if the campground is supposed to be functional?

It seems likely that the NPS will not open the road to White River until 410 is open over Chinook Pass.  I understand that SR 123 (Cayuse) is likely to remain closed until at least July 4th pending major road repair in the vicinity of the tunnel between 410 and Ohanapecosh due to a major slide this winter.  Until there is somewhere to go, it seems unlikely that they would open 410 just to provide access to the White River Road.

There was an earlier TAY poster who had good 410 highway clearing information, so hopefully they will chime in with the latest.

There should be no problem biking 410 to White River and on into the campground right now.

I have the same reservations that J.P. has about the opening.
One more week and they are planning to have Chinook pass open.
Might be oversight by the Park on syncronizing planned opening dates.
Isn't there a gate at the Mather Parking area adjacent to Dry Creek/WR road if they want to resrict traffic to that part of the park just before Big Bertha?

Usually, they open a portion of the WR campground on Memorial Weekend.

This current season I was fortunate enough to be in with the Mount Raineer/Crystal boundries rangers and traveled up and down the road quite a bit during the winter . WSDOT plows the road for the MRNP rangers on one lane up to the White River Campground junction during the WHOLE season so that they can survey the area and count tracks the week before the final weekend at Crystal we drove about a quarter mile from the 123 junction which had a 20 foot base and at that time they had plowed out to the rangers station for the white river campground SO I would imagine that the access to the white river has been plowed out for a while and I the snow before big bertha is completly gone
but more importantly 410 should open memorial day weekend

Hey guys,
Thanks for the great discussion.

Here's the link for the WSDOT, but it didn't have much info on the status of when it would open.
www.wsdot.wa.gov/traffic/passes/passinformation.aspx#chinook

I'm thinking I'll just have to call the park on Friday to find out if they opened it or not.
-Gus

Isn't there a gate at the Mather Parking area adjacent to Dry Creek/WR road if they want to resrict traffic to that part of the park just before Big Bertha?

Joe - There is a gate there, and I have seen it closed in the winter when touring up toward the pass, but I think this is just to keep anyone other than NPS staff from getting up higher should they happen to get past the lower gate at the Blvd.

J.P.

I was curious about this too, because the standard opening is always the Friday of Memorial Day weekend (except last year, of course). I just now called Longmire and was told that 5/19 is definite for the opening of the road to the White River CG.

A good source shared this afternoon that WSDOT is working hard to get 410 open with a goal of the 25th of this month (next Thursday) if all goes well.  Crews working from both sides have met or almost met, and there is much clean-up work still to be done, especially with this warm weather bringing down alot of rocks.  (Charles - It still seems unlikely to me that WR will open on the 19th with Chinook closed.)

Sounds like MRNP does want to get WR open sooner rather than later, but nothing definite.  I get the sense that their interest is more political than anything as they expect to take some heat from the local community (economic impacts) for SR 123 remaining closed for a while.  Sounds like a real mess in a difficult spot there -- both lanes impacted in one slide and a major rock slide in another, both near the tunnel. 

The WR road has been cleared to the camground with equipment starting work up the hill toward Sunrise.

J.P.

A good source shared this afternoon that WSDOT is working hard to get 410 open with a goal of the 25th of this month (next Thursday) if all goes well.  Crews working from both sides have met or almost met, and there is much clean-up work still to be done, especially with this warm weather bringing down alot of rocks.  (Charles - It still seems unlikely to me that WR will open on the 19th with Chinook closed.)

Sounds like MRNP does want to get WR open sooner rather than later, but nothing definite.  I get the sense that their interest is more political than anything as they expect to take some heat from the local community (economic impacts) for SR 123 remaining closed for a while.  Sounds like a real mess in a difficult spot there -- both lanes impacted in one slide and a major rock slide in another, both near the tunnel. 

The WR road has been cleared to the camground with equipment starting work up the hill toward Sunrise.

J.P.

The ranger just stopped in and the WSDOT has decided not to open 410 beyond the Crystal Mountain Blvd. Charles you were correct! They may open it after the weekend but most likely will wait until the opening of Chinook Pass. They are still on schedule to open Chinnok Pass on Thursday the 25th, but it may not be Friday. Once again the users of the park get the short end of the deal! Wapiti Bob

Bummer,
I guess, I get to talk my friends into a 4 mile ski carry on some other weekend then.

Interestingly, they already updated their website.
Scheduled opening May 25.

I would have thought that would take a few days.
-Gus

I posted some details on the other thread also.

Per the DOT person I spoke to at the gate, DOT never opens the road to White River entrance before opening 410 over the pass. They fear, no doubt correctly, that this would be confusing to many drivers who are aiming for Yakima only to end up at a dead end in the park. If this is true, along with the above about the WR road being plowed earlier, it means that the DOT, not the NPS, determines the opening date.

Apparently Hwy 123 has a huge swath completely washed away, plus a rockfall that has essentially filled the tunnel to its brim.

Per the DOT person I spoke to at the gate, DOT never opens the road to White River entrance before opening 410 over the pass. They fear, no doubt correctly, that this would be confusing to many drivers who are aiming for Yakima only to end up at a dead end in the park.

I suppose it could be misleading if you can't add up 2 and 2, and are a tourist without a map. But if you end up there and did not see the big signs in Enumclaw that says Chinook Pass CLOSED, Cayuse Pass CLOSED, Yakima CLOSED-then I think it is your own fault for not reading the sign at the begininng of the drive.
It is only a 10 mile RT drive to the WR road closure and back to the MRP gate. I bet Bob has at least one customer every day that comes to his shop in the Winter thinking that they could get to Yakima or the park, but did not read the signs in Enumclaw.

IMHO-I say if there is no snow to WR open it. Since it was budgeted-Why pay all the Park Rangers to stand around one more week?
Break em in with a soft opening, so when the hordes hit next week they are rehearsed.

If someone thinks that they can get to Yakima when the pass signs say CLOSED. I share the same empathy for them as the Big Rig truck driver who disreguards the NO COMMERCIAL VEHICLE signs and thinks they can sneak their rig over Chinook Pass and gets busted.

I suppose it could be misleading if you can't add up 2 and 2, and are a tourist without a map. But if you end up there and did not see the big signs in Enumclaw that says Chinook Pass CLOSED, Cayuse Pass CLOSED, Yakima CLOSED-then I think it is your own fault for not reading the sign at the begininng of the drive.
It is only a 10 mile RT drive to the WR road closure and back to the MRP gate. I bet Bob has at least one customer every day that comes to his shop in the Winter thinking that they could get to Yakima or the park, but did not read the signs in Enumclaw.

IMHO-I say if there is no snow to WR open it. Since it was budgeted-Why pay all the Park Rangers to stand around one more week?
Break em in with a soft opening, so when the hordes hit next week they are rehearsed.

If someone thinks that they can get to Yakima when the pass signs say CLOSED. I share the same empathy for them as the Big Rig truck driver who disreguards the NO COMMERCIAL VEHICLE signs and thinks they can sneak their rig over Chinook Pass and gets busted.

You are absolutely correct, the park is being managed for the people that don't want to use it, not the people like us that want to use it. For many years I have been trying to get the park to open the road as it is plowed and safe for travel. They do have a gate at the Sunrise Y but have never used it! The park entrance would be a great place for a sno park to allow a cross country ski experience in MRNP on the north side. This year I offered the park some ideas on limited openings knowing the problems that a Cayuse Pass closing would present. But once again it fell on deaf ears! We all need to work together to put pressure on the park to open these roads so we can enjoy the snow in the park. As it is now the road is closed at the Crystal Mtn Blvd until Cayuse Pass is opened. I have proposed to stage openings based on snow and avalanche conditions until Cayuse Pass is open. This would allow people that are trying to get to MRNP as a tourist the opportunity to visit the park in the spring season and have at least a limited experience instead of facing a closed gate at Crystal Mtn Blvd. For the people that are going to Yakima, you could post one more sign or they could just drive a few miles further before turning around. Maybe the rangers could open the gate if you are a park user and turn you around if you are heading to Yakima. I would be glad to hand them a ten dollar bill to go up to the campground this weekend. You are right, getting some folks up there this week before the 3 day weekend makes a lot of sense, maybe that's why the folks at the park don't understand it. A call, letter or e-mail to the park would be a good start.

There were 6 cars parked at the Summerland trailhead today... apparently if you "know someone", you can get past the gate at the Crystal Mtn turnoff...  ???

I'm all for the early and more to the point, year round access to that road access. Writting letters/emails is a good start. My understanding is that Rangers arn't standing around cause they arn't there. It's all about summer staffing levels. The roads can get cleared but the allocation of money for the summer staffing isn't released till a certain date . Just Got to have mounties in the booths!

I'm all for the early and more to the point, year round access to that road access. Writting letters/emails is a good start. My understanding is that Rangers arn't standing around cause they arn't there. It's all about summer staffing levels. The roads can get cleared but the allocation of money for the summer staffing isn't released till a certain date . Just Got to have mounties in the booths!

In the past early seasons they only had the booths at WR open (taking Money) only on weekends and later June when the Sunrise road would open. But now they have become more prevelant during the midweek at the booth.

On a side note-Crystal Mountain funds the Ranger that counts skier tracks in the park on the Crystal mountain side of the road as part of the EIS aggrement that Teter was refering to earlier in the tread, not the NPS. This research data is used by the Park to present scientific evidence that too many skiers are skiing the Park, but that is a whole other can of worms.

Trust me, they must have dispursed the funds for Rangers in the Summer, there are more Rangers than you can shake a stick at right now cruising 410.

I am with Bob that the road should be open in the winter, there are plenty of rangers who are messing around in that area of the Park during the Winter. Plus, I have seen a quiver of volunteers in the Winter months. The road is already plowed to the WR ranger station, might as well plow the rest to the campground. I know realistically there are many cost factors involved, but that would pinch the country club lifestyle that the full time Rangers and their buddies enjoy 6 months out of every year in the WR area.

There were 6 cars parked at the Summerland trailhead today... apparently if you "know someone", you can get past the gate at the Crystal Mtn turnoff... ???

That's pretty lame.

There were 6 cars parked at the Summerland trailhead today... apparently if you "know someone", you can get past the gate at the Crystal Mtn turnoff... ???

I usually avoid that trailhead since it so busy, even when it is closed it is busy!

Did they have White River Road country club stickers on the cars?

As a denizen of Enumclaw, I too am frustrated by the lack of north side access. If I was crafty, I would purchase an old Honda Trail 90 on ebay, drive it up to the White River campground. I think you could get in trouble for this, but it is my understanding that snowmobiles are allowed on the road from the snowpark. Sooo, get a little plastic kiddie sled, cut a slot in it for the front tire of said trail 90 and call it a snowmobike. Then, drive it to Cayuse, sunrise, wherever! If I was crafty, that is.

On a side note-Crystal Mountain funds the Ranger that counts skier tracks in the park on the Crystal mountain side of the road as part of the EIS aggrement that Teter was refering to earlier in the tread, not the NPS. This research data is used by the Park to present scientific evidence that too many skiers are skiing the Park, but that is a whole other can of worms.

I've never understood what the big deal is about skiers entering Mt. Rainier National Park from Crystal. What's the problem? Is a similar count done at Paradise, or say Tatoosh? Is the Ranger stationed there 7 days a week keeping count of ski tracks?

As for park employees having early access, this is no surprise. A few years ago we biked up to Mowich lake to ski the Flett and Russell before the gate was open, although the road was in fine condition. While we were there, several park employees and/or family and friends had driven up to enjoy the area before the public was allowed to drive in.

Did they have White River Road country club stickers on the cars?

No stickers of any kind, except for a "Texas A&M" sticker. Didn't look like park vehicles or anything. Just a large group of folks heading up Little Tahoma presumably.

Shortly after I got back to the gate (on bike), a caravan of 3 cars came back through - looked like different cars than the 6 at Summerland.