- Posts: 146
- Thank you received: 0
Fatality at Muir
- Randy Beaver
- [Randy Beaver]
- Topic Author
- Offline
- Junior Member
"Climber dies on Mount Rainier
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
LONGMIRE, Wash. -- One climber has died on Mount Rainier and the national park says two others are awaiting rescue at Camp Muir.
Ranger Sandi Kinzer at Longmire says a helicopter is waiting for a snow storm to clear to land at Camp Muir, which is at about 10,000 feet elevation. Kinzer says one of the survivors has frostbite and can't walk out from the shelter.
Kinzer says the three went on a day hike Monday to Camp Muir when they were caught in a blizzard on the Muir snowfield.
"
Although the headline says climbers, the day hike scenario mentioned int he body of the article seems more likely to contribute to the fatality. Damn, we're stoked on this storm, but the winter and the wilderness are still potential killers. Or, put another way, not being prepared for winbter in the wilderness is a killer.....
seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/6420ap_wa_m...er_fatal_urgent.html
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Randy Beaver
- [Randy Beaver]
- Topic Author
- Offline
- Junior Member
- Posts: 146
- Thank you received: 0
However, Sandi Kinzer of Mount Rainier National Park said park officials "are not ready to declare that there was a fatality."
Rescuers are working to help two other climbers from the party who were suffering from hypothermic conditions, said the source, who asked not to be identified.
A group of three climbers caught in bad weather Monday spent the night on the Muir Snowfield, the source said. This morning two of the climbers hiked back up to Camp Muir to ask for help.
Mount Rainier National Park rescue rangers are involved in the rescue. The climbers are not believed to be part of a guided climb.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Amar Andalkar
- [andalkar]
- Offline
- Premium Member
- Posts: 635
- Thank you received: 0
Hiker dies on Mt. Rainier
Story Published: Jun 10, 2008 at 12:56 PM PDT
Story Updated: Jun 10, 2008 at 2:41 PM PDT
By KOMO Staff
LONGMIRE, Wash. - A hiker has died on Mount Rainier and the national park says two others are awaiting rescue at Camp Muir.
Park spokesman Kevin Bacher says police received a 911 call around 3:30 a.m. Tuesday from three hikers saying the two men and a woman were stranded on the Muir snowfield.
They had gone for a day hike on Monday, but were caught in a blizzard on their way back to camp. They were able to get into a shelter, but they were still battered by the raging snowstorm.
That's when they called for help, but search crews were not able to begin their rescue due to the weather conditions.
"Conditions were severe," Bacher said. "We had two feet of fresh snow at Paradise (Tuesday) morning and more than that up on the mountain with high winds. At their location where they had taken shelter, there were five-foot snow drifts. It's about as extreme as it gets on the mountain."
Around 7:30 a.m., one member was able to leave the shelter and make it up to Camp Muir and then lead a rescue team back to the shelter near Anvil Rock, a large outcropping at the edge of the Muir snowfield.
Within an hour, all three were taken back to Camp Muir, a staging area for climbers about 10,000 feet elevation. Pierce County Medical Examiners confirm one of the men had died but did not identify him.
The other two suffered from frostbite and hypothermia. Because of their condition, rescue crews are waiting to fly them off the mountain instead of carrying them down and re-exposing them to the cold weather.
Crews were waiting for a break in the weather to get in rescue helicopters. In the meantime, three doctors from their guide services are at the camp monitoring the survivors' conditions. They say they are stable enough that they can wait as long as Wednesday morning if needed.
The three have not been identified, but Bacher said they are couple and a friend, all in their early 30s from Bellevue. Bacher said all three were experienced climbers, with two having summated Mount Rainier before and all three had made several trips to Camp Muir.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- SkiMariner
- [SkiMariner]
- Offline
- New Member
- Posts: 10
- Thank you received: 0
www.nwac.us/products/archive/OSOMUR.2
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- SkiMariner
- [SkiMariner]
- Offline
- New Member
- Posts: 10
- Thank you received: 0
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Randy Beaver
- [Randy Beaver]
- Topic Author
- Offline
- Junior Member
- Posts: 146
- Thank you received: 0
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- philfort
- [philfort]
- Offline
- Senior Member
- Posts: 259
- Thank you received: 0
8pm thru midnight...temps drop below 10 degrees with sustained winds at 60 mph.
We met some people that camped in Glacier Basin (~6500ft) yesterday, and they said winds overnight were blowing at ~60MPH, and two tents collapsed. Pretty unusual for that elevation I would think...
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- SkiMariner
- [SkiMariner]
- Offline
- New Member
- Posts: 10
- Thank you received: 0
They suffered through a long night...amazing that two survived.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Stugie
- [stugelmeyer]
- Offline
- Senior Member
- Posts: 291
- Thank you received: 0
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- brownc9
- [brownc9]
- Offline
- Junior Member
- Posts: 93
- Thank you received: 0
If i were in a situation where i wasn't equiped to spend a night, i'd probably shrug off nasty weather and start down too, i really need to start learning from others mistakes(unfortunate, but they make "Accidents in N. America 20xx" every year) and sit tight. Scary idea though.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- SkiMariner
- [SkiMariner]
- Offline
- New Member
- Posts: 10
- Thank you received: 0
MON MON T UE TUE WED
NIGHT NIGHT
SUMMIT (14411 FT) 7 -6 6 8 10
W 51 NW 45 NW 39 N 30 N 28
CAMP MUIR(10188 FT) 24 11 21 26 28
W 44 W 42 NW 31 N 27 N 27
This forecast was issued Monday morning. Recorded winds were considerably higher than what was forecasted.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Scotsman
- [Scotsman]
- Offline
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 2432
- Thank you received: 0
but,
the forecast was well known and there where extensive warnings on all the sites , NOAA etc. and on the radio and TV reports. The forecast may have been for 45 instead of 60 MPH but based upon what I saw, I would not have gone to Muir on that day.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Stugie
- [stugelmeyer]
- Offline
- Senior Member
- Posts: 291
- Thank you received: 0
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- tomq
- [tomq]
- Offline
- New Member
- Posts: 28
- Thank you received: 0
So, as I read in the paper about what happened it made me immediately think about the decisions that were made. Beginning with the weather forecast, I would agree with Scotsman that I would not have been on Rainier after looking at the forecast that morning. I realize that a lot of that is one's personal comfort level in handling difficult weather conditions and their experience dealing with it. There are obviously people who have experience and know how to handle it - I am not one of those people, so that would keep me off the mountain after seeing the forecast.
I have not climbed to camp Muir before but I have heard the stories of the weather changing very quickly. I am curious to hear from others who have experienced this type of weather while in the backcountry and what are some signs to look for (wind? clouds? snow?) that would cause you to make the decision to either not go or immediately turn around and head down. It is often the hardest decision to turn around after all the time, effort and what looks like good turns ahead but that decision can sometimes save your life.
Thanks for any input.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- brownc9
- [brownc9]
- Offline
- Junior Member
- Posts: 93
- Thank you received: 0
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Snow Bell
- [Snow Bell]
- Offline
- Junior Member
- Posts: 177
- Thank you received: 0
www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/...un12,0,5906441.story
Very sad. Myself also being in my early thirties with two small children lets me identify pretty closely with this. I frequently wonder if the risks that I take in the mountains are justifiable in terms of my responsibilities to my family. I suppose that we learn what we can and try to remember that none of us are immune. Mistakes included.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- mahandl
- [mahandl]
- Offline
- New Member
- Posts: 1
- Thank you received: 0
I have hiked to Camp Muir numerous times to get in shape for our summit attempts. We ALWAYS carry a compass and know the correct heading across the Snowfield. The weather on the mountain is always unpredictable and changes very quickly at elevation. When you get on the Muir Snowfield, the wind alone can make it seem like a blizzard from the blowing snow. It's very easy to become disoriented. Last year, in one situation, we encountered a blizzard with snow falling hard and blowing hard from 45 mph winds. I could barely see my hiking companions and I couldn't see the guide wands unless I was right on top of them. I couldn't see the footsteps of the guy in front of me in our "train" because the blowing snow covered them almost instantly. We always carry a compass and know the correct heading to get across the Muir Snowfield -- we use this to avoid wandering "over the edge" and down the rocks and to avoid avalanche dangers at the edges. It might be unusual that the winds were as high as 70 mph, but the conditions themselves (snow, temps, winds) are not unusual at all. It's seems like it's always blowing around 30-40 mph there making it hard to stand-up even in "clear" conditions. Personally, if I read a weather forecast that predicted snow down to the 2000 elevation level, up to 12" in the Cascade passes, and 45 mph winds, I wouldn't have gone on the hike. My Rainier hiking pals said the same thing.
But folks can hike up there in perfect conditions a few times and come to the conclusion that it's always a shirtsleeve hike. I feel so bad for them -- the fear they felt must have been overwhelming.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Bandit
- [Bandit]
- Offline
- Senior Member
- Posts: 292
- Thank you received: 0
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Lowell_Skoog
- [Lowell_Skoog]
- Offline
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 1460
- Thank you received: 16
As I read the newspaper account, I thought about other tragedies on the Muir snowfield. It occurred to me that the Muir snowfield may be the most dangerous place in the Cascades, based on the number of deaths that have occurred there. Does anyone know if this is true?
It's a sobering thought. The most dangerous place in the Cascades is not the Willis Wall, SE Mox Peak, Lincoln Peak or any of those fearsome climbs. It's the good old Muir snowfield. I'm going to let that sink for in a while.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- alpentalcorey
- [alpentalcorey]
- Offline
- Junior Member
- Posts: 180
- Thank you received: 0
As I read the newspaper account, I thought about other tragedies on the Muir snowfield. It occurred to me that the Muir snowfield may be the most dangerous place in the Cascades, based on the number of deaths that have occurred there. Does anyone know if this is true?
My guess is that it would be Stevens Pass, although perhaps that doesn't count.
It's such a sad story, condolences to all friends and family. So tragic.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Andrew Carey
- [acarey]
- Offline
- Elite Member
- Posts: 912
- Thank you received: 0
Condolences to all those involved this tragedy.
As I read the newspaper account, I thought about other tragedies on the Muir snowfield. It occurred to me that the Muir snowfield may be the most dangerous place in the Cascades, based on the number of deaths that have occurred there. Does anyone know if this is true?
It's a sobering thought. The most dangerous place in the Cascades is not the Willis Wall, SE Mox Peak, Lincoln Peak or any of those fearsome climbs. It's the good old Muir snowfield. I'm going to let that sink for in a while.
If you include number of people taking a risk, how could it not be, even if the risk of falling, rock fall, avalanches, etc. is low on the snow field itself? It's so well known and so popular with climbers, skiers, serious hikers, and casual tourists. I've "saved" more than one up there by persuading them to turn around, informing them there is no restaurant at Camp Muir, and informing them of where they were and how to get down (in sunny weather).
As everyone here recognizes, it is very easy to get caught by bad weather/poor visibility up there and I have been up above Pan Pt. and even Pebble Creek intentionally in high winds, heavy snow, fog, etc. But I would not go very far onto the snowfield with the kind of weather that was forecast; that's foolhardy. Compassion makes it hard to criticize people who have been through harrowing and deadly tragic events, but that is the way to make the less wary, more wary. Of course, the clueless won't even read the reports.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Lowell_Skoog
- [Lowell_Skoog]
- Offline
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 1460
- Thank you received: 16
My guess is that it would be Stevens Pass, although perhaps that doesn't count.
I'm not aware of that many fatalities at Stevens Pass, but maybe I haven't been paying attention. I assume you're talking about skiers, not people driving the highway.
It would be interesting to draw a one-mile wide corridor straddling the route from Paradise to Camp Muir and tally all the fatalities that have occurred there. I would also count incidents where people wandered out of that corridor because they were lost and later died. I flipped through Molenaar's "Challenge of Rainier" and here's what I found:
1897, Edgar McClure, fall on rocks
1915, C.W. Ferguson, ice cave accident
1917, Dorothy Haskell, crevasse fall
1940, Sigurd Hall, skiing crash
1957, Lowell Linn, disappearance
1967, Louden family (3), fall into snow covered stream
1967, Elmer and David Post, crevasse fall
1968, Edith Anderson, exposure
1968, James Reddick, exposure
1969, John Aigars, avalanche
Molenaar's tally peters out after 1969. I know that Mike McNerthney died in an avalanche near Panorama Point in 1977. Kirk Reiser died in an avalanche in Edith Creek basin last December. I remember that several people disppeared or died of exposure in 1999. I'm sure there are more I've forgotten.
I suspect that if you were to tally them all up, they would exceed even the Ingraham Glacier tally, which is skewed by the 1981 icefall avalanche that killed 11 climbers.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- ron j
- [ron_j]
- Offline
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 1087
- Thank you received: 0
John Repke was lost in May of 1999 or 2000? and found in late summer/fall of the same year in his sleeping bag on the upper Paradise Gl.
Kirk (or Kirt?) ?? a young doctor from Georgia that traveled to Seattle to begin his residency at one of our major hospitals left Camp Muir in the clouds on a snowboard in 2001 or maybe 2002, and was found, I think two years later (i seem to recall it being a low snow year) down below the Pebble Creek falls in the drainage going down into the Nisqually Gl moraine.
I'm sure there's others...
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Mike_Gauthier
- [Mike_Gauthier]
- Offline
- New Member
- Posts: 12
- Thank you received: 0
I'm not aware of that many fatalities at Stevens Pass, but maybe I haven't been paying attention. I assume you're talking about skiers, not people driving the highway.
It would be interesting to draw a one-mile wide corridor straddling the route from Paradise to Camp Muir and tally all the fatalities that have occurred there. I would also count incidents where people wandered out of that corridor because they were lost and later died. I flipped through Molenaar's "Challenge of Rainier" and here's what I found:
1897, Edgar McClure, fall on rocks
1915, C.W. Ferguson, ice cave accident
1917, Dorothy Haskell, crevasse fall
1940, Sigurd Hall, skiing crash
1957, Lowell Linn, disappearance
1967, Louden family (3), fall into snow covered stream
1967, Elmer and David Post, crevasse fall
1968, Edith Anderson, exposure
1968, James Reddick, exposure
1969, John Aigars, avalanche
Molenaar's tally peters out after 1969. I know that Mike McNerthney died in an avalanche near Panorama Point in 1977. Kirk Reiser died in an avalanche in Edith Creek basin last December. I remember that several people disppeared or died of exposure in 1999. I'm sure there are more I've forgotten.
I suspect that if you were to tally them all up, they would exceed even the Ingraham Glacier tally, which is skewed by the 1981 icefall avalanche that killed 11 climbers.
Yes, there's John Repka and Tres Tjeiten (summer 1999), Tim and Greg Stark (spring 2005) Ray Valkili, Chris Hartonas (fall 1999), and a number of "close calls." I'm sure there are more, that I'm not remembering.
I don't know if it statisically the muir snowfield would be rated that "hazardous overall," as thousand and thousands successfully make it up and down, which would skew the rate.
As noted, if you've hiked or skiied the snowfield that much, it's quite likely that you've had a close call with getting off route, or know someone who has.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Alan Brunelle
- [BigSnow]
- Offline
- Senior Member
- Posts: 260
- Thank you received: 0
What can you do? It is surprising that there are not more incidents.
In this case, one could imagine that given their purported experience level that they wanted to experience the conditions that they were exposed to. Thats what I was thinking when I first heard of this. Wasn't just about everyone aware of what the weather was supposed to be? Our consistently cool cloudy and wet weather this year has made national news and certainly even non mountain travelers were complaining about the next upcoming storm and snow producer. Are current condition and forecast conditions not available at Paradise?
In any case, the latest article in the times described the effort these individuals made to survive and it seemed apparent that they were short of the equipment needed to stay the night in a trench. From what I read, maybe just short. All that they would have needed to make it was a single thermarest or other pad and a small tarp. Very unfortunate and sad.
Alan
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- jdclimber
- [jdclimber]
- Offline
- Junior Member
- Posts: 156
- Thank you received: 0
I think that some of the new coverage was aweful and insensitive . The thought of a reporter ratting around the neighborhood and place of business looking for stories about a dead guy is pretty gross. She would get more than a "no comment" if she were askinig me for details on a friend, neighbor or co-worker.
Relating to the young doctor lost in 2000 or 2001. When he was found, a good family friend (known for poor judgement) was lost between Muir and Paradise. She and partner set up a tent on the Nisqually after taking a wrong turn and seeing gaping crevasses. I was running interference between my friend's family and the hardworking rangers, to try and keep the family informed enough to stay away from the rangers. When found, my family friend expected praise for staying put after getting lost. They found the young doctor within 200M of my friend's tent.
I believe that the Muir snowfield has much of the same issues as Mt. Hood, in that the fall line will not get you home, but into trouble. This causes much trouble for the human animal after walking uphill all day.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Alan Brunelle
- [BigSnow]
- Offline
- Senior Member
- Posts: 260
- Thank you received: 0
I figure there is much more to what happened than we will likely know, for one person to die of hypothermia and two other are able to walk uphill 1400 ft the next day leads me to believe that there are pieces missing.
I think that is supported by the Times report this morning and what I was referring to in my post as well. It was stated that once they got the trench built, he entered first and lay on the bottom with the other two on top of him. It also stated that snow melt below him caused him to become saturated and refrozen through his clothing, which was the reason for the hypothermia. I think that falls into hero category.
Alan
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Lowell_Skoog
- [Lowell_Skoog]
- Offline
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 1460
- Thank you received: 16
I don't know if it statisically the muir snowfield would be rated that "hazardous overall," as thousand and thousands successfully make it up and down, which would skew the rate.
Yeah, I agree completely. The accident rate per traveller is probably lower than many other places in the Cascades. But the total number of accidents is high.
You might say that the Bowling Alley Couloir (a made-up location) is the most "dangerous" (i.e. accidents per capita) while the Paradise to Muir route is the most "deadly" (i.e. most accidents overall). It's just a intellectual exercise to look at things in a different light, especially when you're feeling helpless about the latest tragedy...
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Gary Vogt
- [vogtski]
- Offline
- Premium Member
- Posts: 511
- Thank you received: 8
As noted, if you've hiked or skiied the snowfield that much, it's quite likely that you've had a close call with getting off route, or know someone who has.
Interesting that despite the fall-line from Camp Muir leading to the Nisqually Glacier canyon, many, if not most of the victims and survivors end up east of the ascent route, probably due to the strong prevailing wind. I recall a fellow back in the 70's, storm-separated from his winter climbing partners just below Muir, who pounded on the Ohana ranger's door ten nights later.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Bandit
- [Bandit]
- Offline
- Senior Member
- Posts: 292
- Thank you received: 0
6 9 1200 22 97 36 46 55 353
6 9 1300 19 95 31 45 57 353
6 9 1400 21 97 29 42 57 353
6 9 1500 21 97 35 45 54 353
6 9 1600 20 97 28 47 61 353
6 9 1700 21 96 43 54 71 353
6 9 1800 17 96 32 49 62 353
6 9 1900 14 95 24 45 65 353
6 9 2000 8 91 24 42 61 353
6 9 2100 6 91 11 37 55 353
6 9 2200 8 92 22 44 57 353
6 9 2300 9 93 34 48 59 353
6 10 0 10 93 39 49 59 353
6 10 100 10 93 36 51 61 353
6 10 200 12 94 27 45 59 353
6 10 300 12 94 7 29 45 353
6 10 400 14 95 4 11 24 353
Not to Monday morning quarterback this accident. But, I think it is important to study the facts of this incident, to prevent other mistakes in judgement. This weather fact is copied from Amar Andal website.
At 12 noon , when the hikers left Paradise, the temps were 22* and winds were max @ 55mph.(MUIR)P The max winds during their hike were 57,57,54,61,71,62,65,61,55,57,59,61,59,45 and 24 mph.
Not sure of their motives. Were they training for a Denali climb? Possible. People do that on Rainier. Again, this is not a criticism of these folks , just a study of the facts.
The wind direction was a constant 353*. Evidence of a sustained storm.
Was it calm at Paradise when they left? Probably.
I've been at Crystal Mt skiing with almost no wind at the base area, but having the REX chair closed because of 60-70mph winds. (@ 7,000')
Mountains are very deceiving.
I left Paradise with a partner one time in nice conditions. As we approached Pan Point, the winds started to pick up, as we continued to Pebble Creek, we were looking for some rock out croppings for protection from the wind. We were day hiking , to Camp Muuir. No sleeping bags, no tent, no stove. My partner and I talked for about 15 minutes , yelling at each other over the wind, debating, should we go further or call it quits? We turned around. On the way down, it was a total white out. The only way we got back on track was to listen for voices from hikers coming up and finally we found the wands the NPS placed.
Everyone has to make a choice when in the mountains.
Somtimes you roll the dice. That is what makes being in the mountains invigorating.
Much regards to the family of the injured and deceased. As much as we should let things lay, we should also learn from this incident to prevent others fatal mistakes.
Ther is nothing wrong with pushing the envelope in the mountains. Personally, high winds will make me turn back more than anything. Cold and snowy, OK. But when you mix high wind into the eqaution . Forget it. I'm out of there.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.