Mt Hood's new Howitzer and Newton Creek Access?

My criticism of the Howitzer program is in no way a reflection of the personnel of the ski partroll. I am sure they are great people as most people are. They are doing a tough job that needs to be done, and I want them to be safe as much as the next person. I understand that they are going to fire the gun in low or no visibility, that would make sense to me. I am not a professional avi person, have had some training just like I would think most people on this board have. So I am not a compete idiot, just shy of that. However, there is always a slope to ski even in extreme avi conditions. One of these areas for me happens to be Newton Creek.

I understand that they have to close off the upper heather, but lower heather they don't need to. They are not going to blast into the trees. When accessing the area I always hit newton by skinning up lower pea gravel ridge. I should be able to access that even if they are blowing the upper, and it looks like they have addressed that. Now if we can get clear info exactly where they blow upper pea gravel we can keep people out of the area, such as elevation on pea gravel ridge. A great idea might be an air horn they blow only prior to using the howitzer to people can get off the upper ridge and prevent what happend to an earlier poster, not when they are using hand charges.

I hope (and it appears) that this howitzer program continues to change to the benefit to all. This forum can be and is a place for people to post their concerns. If Meadows is smart they will be checking places like this for issues that develop and possible ways to address those issues.

No one here is spraying about the program, but have legitimate concerns that need to be addressed even if the program is not altered.

Thanks for posting the organizations dealing with meadows. I am going to read what they have on it.

Does anybody know where I can blow up (pun intended) the images from this page so I can actually read them and pass them along to my friends.

Crag Law Center

Here is one of the images I pulled from the Meadows web site, the other one I could not find however you can probably call the Crag Law Center and they would be happy to send it to you.

Take note: They will be using the Howitzer tomorrow December 6th, when the avy hazard is high and most bc skiers would be wise to avoid skiing 30% + slopes anyway.  The freezing level is going to 8,000 and with all the fresh snow they will be accomplishing there goal.

{MT HOOD AREA-

....AVALANCHE WARNING FOR MONDAY THROUGH TUESDAY....

Monday: HIGH avalanche danger above 4000 feet and
CONSIDERABLE Below.
Monday night: Slowly decreasing HIGH avalanche danger
above 4-5000 feet and CONSIDERABLE below.
Tuesday and Tuesday night: Significantly increasing
danger Tuesday morning becoming EXTREME above 5-6000 feet
and HIGH below.}

Thanks BC skier.

Maybe after things have settled a bit a no bull FAQ page for newton creek can be created so people don't have to wade through all this to get the important info. Things seem to be too fluid right now for that. Heck maybe it could go on the Meadows web site(as I see it there is a lot of bull). Maybe that would be asking too much.

This has been a good discussion.  Meadows will continue to restrict public land access and possibly endanger BC visitors if allowed to do so.  If we, the wintertime BC visitors push back, we can be successful if we're organized and communicate.  The CRAG Law Center and Snowrider are the organizations that will lead the push-back.  We can help by relating our encounters and experiences, good or bad, in written form to those organizations. 

This is a request for factual statements from hikers, climbers, skiers, etc who have been asked to stay away from the ski area or who have found themselves in immediate danger from the use of the howitzer.  I have volunteered to receive and steer the data to CRAG and Snowrider so they may build a database of BC user experiences with MHM.

If you'd like to get involved, please email to me (This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.) your statements with your name, address, a short description of your experience, and the date of the experience.  I will keep your statements private except to send them to CRAG and Snowrider.

Our voices are what gives us the access we like and have enjoyed until recently.  If we act to make our voices heard loud and clear, we can continue to get the access we need.

Thanks and Happy Turns, John Speth - EMAIL = This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.

To better understand where backcountry skiers are skiing within, or out of, the ski area boundries I have attached another map with red letters.

Please let us know where you ski.

Thanks

Please let us know where you ski.

Here's my contribution which I'm sure is ordinary:

I usually take to Newton in powder days and stay in or near the trees at A and lower, sometimes even laps on the south side of lower Pea Gravel in the trees. In spring conditions (no avy danger) I go higher up Pea Gravel which takes me down B. Usually the trip home involves a final a ride down lower C (near the A) if it's not too crusty.

Hey folks -

On February 5th, there is a movie night in Portland to benefit the Madrone Wall Preservation Committee.  Meadows folks will be there discussing their avy control operations and their uphill and backcountry access policies.  We invited them to the event, because we have heard increasing concerns about conflicts and public access.  Please show up if you're interested in getting information straight from the source and letting them know what you think.

I just asked the FS about no uphill skiing, since until now I was under the impression ski areas could only charge for rides, not restrict access. The response I got was the ski area can restrict access IF the FS says they can which they have done for the first time this year. They said they did this because BC types have ignored closed signs and there have been close calls last year and because of the new artillery.

Apparently there has always been a county law that while you can ski into an area you can't exit it (except vis parking lot?).

Certainly the new rule is easier to communicate and there can be no misunderstandings, lower liability. Also if some of areas above the skiout are closed they don't have to mark them closed except at the top, or maybe the sides if folks would traverse down into them. It would also make it easier to catch folks going into a closed run since they could be spotted going up or down a closed area, but also going up the ski out.

I would like to see them open up the skiout at least when eveyrthing is open, heather is running, private reserve is open etc. I doubt that will happen if people keep breaking the rules. Closing the rest of the ski area seems like overkill as well, but is something MHM would like to do anyway?

At least they let you go up the skiout to cross Clark Creek since that is sometimes the only way across Clark Creek.

I did notice an avalanche on Newton looked like it came right thru the gates of the mtn. Probably natural given the extreme hazard they had recently?

Did anyone attend the Hollywood theater event? Any comments about the discussion of the closures or Howitzer?

Did anyone attend the Hollywood theater event?  Any comments about the discussion of the closures or Howitzer?

Christ, I truly wish I could have been there. Unfortunately I was busy skiing in a wilderness area where there were no bomb threats. It was less than exhilarating to experience backcountry adventure outside of the war-zone. Oh well, I guess there is always Afghanistan.